QuickPro

With all the controversy in the United States today I decided to make a thread about it so we can collaborate opinions.

This previous Monday thosands of protestors refused to work, really didn't have that big of an effect but what I think people need to look at are the underlying issues that people are missing. For example, since when was illegal immigration made into such a huge deal? It's always been a problem because it is impossible to control the border but now it seems to be a major focus of the US even though troops are dying every single day over sea's... but that's another issue. Seriously though, I think the reason that the whole issue was ever made as big as it was because of a political strategy from the right.

My theory:

The conservatives do not protect minorities, they protect rich white people with tax cuts. What does this whole ploy of cracking down on illegal immigration bring to the table? It's actually brilliant in my opinion, the conservatives are proposing that we crack down much harder on the border and illegals. Let's take a step back and look at this, what jobs do illegal immigrants hold? Yes, the shit jobs, they pick berries and do other jobs that most people would not like to do. Who does this upset? The uneducated and poor white people that would like to be doing these jobs for minimum wage even though illegals are willing to do it for less. So when republicans move to crack down on the illegals, the poor and uneducated white people have an obvious side to choose. So this ploy, which is inneffective in the first place will completely win over everyone in the middle who has mixed feelings about immigration and poor, uneducated people who don't know any better.

This leaves the left in a tough spot (when I say "left" I mean democrats). They are much more in favor of making policies that help make illegal immigrants more "legal" in a sense by granting health care and common benifits of being a United States citizen. What happens here though is that they do not want to lose votes by objecting to the ideas that conservatives are proposing, otherwise they would lose the middle and invaluable states like Texas and California (Which one is needed to win a presidential election).

The rights argument:

1. Illegals take jobs that American Citizens could use.
*Objection: Our unemployment rate is at an all time low and we don't like these jobs anyways.
2. Illegals collect on social services yet they fail to pay into them
*Objection: Our social services are incredibly unsubstancial for even most Americans.
3. Some ignorant ass thing like "They committ more crime and are taking up too much room in jail"
*Out of Blacks, Hispanics, and Whites, Hispanics have the lowest population in our prison system. This could change however cause the newest ploy to deter illegals is to charge them with "Trespassing" which is beyon ludicrous to me but seems to be substantial to put illegals in jail.

It's a tough one but in my opinion the only thing that's going to happen is a few hate crimes, Republicans winning more votes, and in a month it will blow over.

Discuss.

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SubNoiZe

you brought up many great arguments quick pro. my personal opinion is that we need more strageties to get out of iraq and less about illegal immigrants. bush has gotten us into a heaping load of shit and yet, we have heard no apologies. first the war was about "weapons of mass disTRACtion" and now after the "war was declared over" 3 years ago many soliders continue to die in this "operation iraqi freedom". okay on to the topic at hand.
this is the united states of america. we have many "supposed" freedoms. mexican workers do not earn shit in their country so they come to america and send their money back home. i, for one, do not have a problem with this. sure, some people say it is a waste of tax dollars providing them with health insurance and tax free salaries, but i say how much have we spent on the 2 wars that bush created? how much do we spend on the drug war each year?? hispanics are human beings also. they deserve to be treated as equals. i have much more to say and will probaly edit this later but i will finish with this:

if i were mexican, i would enter into this country illegally to provide an adequate living for my family. i would leave my wife and kids and risk my life to enter america and work my ass off and send most of the money back home. after all, money is the american way.

again, this is all my opinion. and opinions are like assholes.. everyone has one!

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QuickPro

I agree, our focus as Americans and the focus of our leaders is seemingly lacking in direction. I won't even get started on the "Let's spend a lot of money to trick people into thinking drugs are worse then they really are war" because I just get frustrated.

I think the thing you said about why you personally would enter into this country illegaly is exactly what people fail to recognize. Hispanics are genetically engineered to commit crime and steal social benefits. Illegals come to this country in hopes of bettering their lives and usually take great sacrafices to do so. While that's not an excuse for illegal behavior I think it does need to be realized that they aren't here to be lazy and do drugs.

The war in Iraq is simply mind boggling to me. I don't understand how any one can be "for" the War on... wait what was it again, WMD's, Terrorists... It changes so often I forget . Anyways, if people could only realize there is no way to "beat" or "win" terror. Terror is a word that represents the twisted beliefs of a small population of people. They are indiscriminate in who they kill, they lack rational reasoning, and base their entire existence off of a horrific set of beliefs. Similarily I do not consider the KKK or any other extremist group as an "enemy" or even as people. Hate is something that cannot be fought or eliminated no matter how great of a government the country has, just look at our country, supposedly the strongest, most advanced, most equal and then read in the paper how to homosexual men were denied the right to marriage in California last week. While not as severe and not nearly as serious, it's frightening how much like terrorism this resembles to me.

Thanks for the reply SR.

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SheiK

We went to war because 4+ intelligence agencies came to us saying that Saddam had weapons of mass distruction.

Anyways, I don't support illegal immigration. If it's controlled, I might like it. But they take from the taxpayer's wallet things that they really shouldn't be receiving.

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WAN73D

My opinion:
Bad for national security.

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"This city deserves a better class of criminal."
Waiting for APB

ReVeLaTioN

At my school last week their was a huge walkout of all of the Mexican's in my town. They paraded with American flags and chanted and such. If there was a huge group of white American's doing that in Mexico at one of their big cities...we would probably be sentenced to death. The thing these people don't realize is that illegal immigrants are "illegal". If the American government wanted them to stay they wouldn't have made the law in the first place. I for one don't have a problem with the Mexican's staying, as long as they don't become an inconvienance to the rest of us. If they just live normal lives, go to work, pay their taxes, etc., then I think they would be a great addition to our country. However, if they want to change the National Anthem into Spanish, make all of our signs say spanish translations, then they are mistaken. They can't expect to illegally sneak into this country and then recieve all of these rights and ability to change National issues. If they go through legally and get their green cards then it is fine...to protest or to complain about the government. I agree that the process of becoming American citizens should be sped up, but until then illegal immigrants should not be able to act the way they are

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XBL: xReVeLaTioN
AIM: CBrass28

QuickPro

*Bumped*

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Brutal Verde

my coach is illegally here ... somebody call immigrations and have her ass deported because I cant stand her. Thank you

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Example

Well, first of all I have nothing againsed immagrants. But there are some who will come to the US illigally and act like they deserve rights, like they deserve to be treated better. I saw a picture the other day were a bunch of hispanic kids at a highschool all went outside, took down the American flag, put their flag up, and put the American flag below it, upside down.

I for one think that it's unbelivable how they treat the country that is keeping them from being poor beggers in Mexico. If they come here to make an honest living, I see nothing wrong with it, but alot come here to sell drugs/commit crimes.

Also, I'm joining the armed forces. So everyone who is anti-war is simply saying that everyone who is laying down their lives in Iraq is dieing for nothing. If I was in Iraq I woulden't want everybody here saying that what I'm fighting for is dumb, or pointless.

And, if you think Mr. Ketsup guy could have done a better presedency job then you may be learning gay sex ed in a few years.

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QuickPro

Example,

You are right about the immigrants who think that they deserve "special" treatment, and the fact that the American flag should be on top simply becuase this is America. Immigration has always been a problem and I think that what needs to be done is to have faster ways of making immigrants legal. Even considering rounding up all the millions of illegals and deporting them so they can just come back illegally again is out right stupid. We need a faster and more efficient way of letting people come to the United States.

As for people who are opposed to the war in Iraq lacking patriotism I have to firmly disagree with you. I am planning on joining the military after next spring (I get my bachelors). I am against the war in Iraq. I think that it lacks purpose and a realistic objective. However, this does not make me someone who is unpatriotic. My Uncle is a military veteran and is also against the war. I support and honor this countries greatness and our freedom and will fight to preserve that. I just don't see how anyone could be "for" losing over 2000 troops over giving people a government that they didn't want in the first place.

Calling people unpatriotic because they don't support this current war is a downright ignorant thing to say and it really is upsetting to those who have served in the military and are belittled because they don't believe in what's happening to day. I will fight proudly for this country but I refuse to be in support of what is happening today.

What exactly is "Gay sex education"? Instead of the vagina a man puts his penis into another mans anus. There's really not that big a difference and I think that the main focus of sex education is to prevent unwanted pregancies and STD's not religious views that say homosexuality is an abomination or to make moral decisions as to saying whether or not homosexuality is right or wrong. At least Mr. Ketchup man knows that "strategury" isn't a word.

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